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Thread: jinn and ahlul kitab

  1. #1

    jinn and ahlul kitab

    Is it possible that Christians and Jews can combat jinn and magic etc using The Torah and Injeel? Was there stuff contained in there that would be used as a ruqya the way the Quran can be used for ruqya, and would it still be valid or would its effect ls have been abrogated by the arrival of the Quran?

    You see a lot of Christian based stuff with all the 'healing' etc and was wondering if there are Christians who actually are exorcists as opposed to being shayatin and actually being the root of the problem.

    One reason this question was asked was for dawah purposes; if someone from the people of the scripture enquire as to the Islamic stance on jinn and possession etc, are we to explain that their local 'priest' is involved in magic etc

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by Raiyyan86 View Post
    Is it possible that Christians and Jews can combat jinn and magic etc using The Torah and Injeel? Was there stuff contained in there that would be used as a ruqya the way the Quran can be used for ruqya, and would it still be valid or would its effect ls have been abrogated by the arrival of the Quran?
    That, I don't know. The Torah and Injeel that was revealed 'could' have been used against the shayaateen, much like the Qur'aan, but I have no knowledge of that, not in affirmation nor in rejection. I simply don't know. However, what is a fact is that much of the 'bible' of today is NOT the word of Allaah, especially the New testament, so I doubt any of it would have any affect.

    Quote Originally Posted by Raiyyan86 View Post
    You see a lot of Christian based stuff with all the 'healing' etc and was wondering if there are Christians who actually are exorcists as opposed to being shayatin and actually being the root of the problem.
    No doubt, Christians do exorcisms, much like the muslims, and there is no doubt that when they do it the Jinn 'appear' to leave, but I would argue that the reasons they left are for different reasons. When the Qur'aan is recited to the Jinn, they actually feel pain, and do all sorts, and they try their best to stay, or stop the person from reciting. But once they leave, then they leave because of the effect the Qur'aan had on them. As for Christians, I would argue that they only 'appear' to leave in order to convince them that their kufr is true. So you see that when they call upon Eesaa, and say 'in the name of eesaa leave' and the Jinn suddenly is gone, then I would say that this is part of the wider plot of the Jinn to deceive the people.


    Quote Originally Posted by Raiyyan86 View Post
    One reason this question was asked was for dawah purposes; if someone from the people of the scripture enquire as to the Islamic stance on jinn and possession etc, are we to explain that their local 'priest' is involved in magic etc
    There is NO DOUBT that their priests and pastors are fully involved in Magic, and anyone who has had any experience with them would know that. They dabble in Jinn, and I'm sure that some of them don't even know it!!! i.e., they call upon the 'holy spirit' to come into them and to possess them. Who said it was anything holy?

  3. #3
    Here is a relavant video of a good brother who is involved in battling the Jinn. If anyone has any concerns related to being possessed, or knows someone who might need help, you can contact him.

    YouTube Link


  4. #4

    Tackling the bad Jinns

    I am going to approach this issue in a general and open manner. I live in S E Asia, where, besides Islam, Christianity and Judaism - there are also Hinduism, Taoism, Buddhism etc. For your information people from these belief groups also interact with supernatural beings to attain healing or peaceful coexistence. And I do know that they have their own ways of doing it and often times they are also successful.

    So I believe the communicative skills with the unseen are not confined to successes of Muslims only; anyone can do it - as long as they know the basics. Please recall: In the Ayatul Kursi, it is mentioned,

    "Who is there can intercede (help) in His presence except as He permitteth?"

    Hence, if Allah permits (i.e., if someone does some doings to help or hurt people and he does it in accordance to Allah laws or Qada' & Qadar') the doings may result in positive outcomes. But this 'grant' does not mean that Allah gives his blessing in totality. The blessings for the Akhirat especially is dependent on Allah's Goodwill (رضا) and the intention (نية) of the doer. The ability for people (the non muslim especially) to do good or bad within the knowledge and permission of Allah reflects Allah's Rahman and 'Adl (in this worldly life). Allahuwaklam.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Domo View Post
    I am going to approach this issue in a general and open manner. I live in S E Asia, where, besides Islam, Christianity and Judaism - there are also Hinduism, Taoism, Buddhism etc. For your information people from these belief groups also interact with supernatural beings to attain healing or peaceful coexistence. And I do know that they have their own ways of doing it and often times they are also successful.

    So I believe the communicative skills with the unseen are not confined to successes of Muslims only; anyone can do it - as long as they know the basics. Please recall: In the Ayatul Kursi, it is mentioned,

    "Who is there can intercede (help) in His presence except as He permitteth?"

    Hence, if Allah permits (i.e., if someone does some doings to help or hurt people and he does it in accordance to Allah laws or Qada' & Qadar') the doings may result in positive outcomes. But this 'grant' does not mean that Allah gives his blessing in totality. The blessings for the Akhirat especially is dependent on Allah's Goodwill (رضا) and the intention (نية) of the doer. The ability for people (the non muslim especially) to do good or bad within the knowledge and permission of Allah reflects Allah's Rahman and 'Adl (in this worldly life). Allahuwaklam.
    With regards to the ability for non-muslims to communicate with the world of the Jinn is not something that anyone denies. Allaah said in the Qur'aan,

    وَاتَّبَعُوا مَا تَتْلُو الشَّيَاطِينُ عَلَىٰ مُلْكِ سُلَيْمَانَ ۖ وَمَا كَفَرَ سُلَيْمَانُ وَلَٰكِنَّ الشَّيَاطِينَ كَفَرُوا يُعَلِّمُونَ النَّاسَ السِّحْرَ وَمَا أُنزِلَ عَلَى الْمَلَكَيْنِ بِبَابِلَ هَارُوتَ وَمَارُوتَ ۚ وَمَا يُعَلِّمَانِ مِنْ أَحَدٍ حَتَّىٰ يَقُولَا إِنَّمَا نَحْنُ فِتْنَةٌ فَلَا تَكْفُرْ ۖ فَيَتَعَلَّمُونَ مِنْهُمَا مَا يُفَرِّقُونَ بِهِ بَيْنَ الْمَرْءِ وَزَوْجِهِ ۚ وَمَا هُم بِضَارِّينَ بِهِ مِنْ أَحَدٍ إِلَّا بِإِذْنِ اللَّهِ ۚ وَيَتَعَلَّمُونَ مَا يَضُرُّهُمْ وَلَا يَنفَعُهُمْ ۚ وَلَقَدْ عَلِمُوا لَمَنِ اشْتَرَاهُ مَا لَهُ فِي الْآخِرَةِ مِنْ خَلَاقٍ ۚ وَلَبِئْسَ مَا شَرَوْا بِهِ أَنفُسَهُمْ ۚ لَوْ كَانُوا يَعْلَمُونَ


    Which means:
    And they followed [instead] what the devils had recited during the reign of Solomon. It was not Solomon who disbelieved, but the devils disbelieved, teaching people magic and that which was revealed to the two angels at Babylon, Harut and Marut. But the two angels do not teach anyone unless they say, "We are a trial, so do not disbelieve [by practicing magic]." And [yet] they learn from them that by which they cause separation between a man and his wife. But they do not harm anyone through it except by permission of Allah . And the people learn what harms them and does not benefit them. But the Children of Israel certainly knew that whoever purchased the magic would not have in the Hereafter any share. And wretched is that for which they sold themselves, if they only knew.

    So it is not a problem to accept that they can 'communicate'. However, I think that issue is whether this communication is 'beneficial' or 'harmful'. Some may see that a person being sick then goes to the magician to receive a cure, and then leaves feeling cured (and maybe is) that this is benefit. However this is from the biggest harm, as the curing of the physical body while destroying the spiritual soul with Shirk and Kufr cannot be overlooked. Much like Allaah said about Alcohol and Gambling:

    "يَسْأَلُونَكَ عَنِ الْخَمْرِ وَالْمَيْسِرِ ۖ قُلْ فِيهِمَا إِثْمٌ كَبِيرٌ وَمَنَافِعُ لِلنَّاسِ وَإِثْمُهُمَا أَكْبَرُ مِن نَّفْعِهِمَا ۗ "


    Which means
    "They ask you about wine and gambling. Say, "In them is great sin and [yet, some] benefit for people. But their sin is greater than their benefit.""

    As for exorcism, then agreed, muslims are not the only ones who claim to be able to 'cure' possession, however we are the only ones who genuinely cure someone who is possessed, as with other people, then it is only a means of deception on behalf of the Jinn. Much like the Jinn who possessed a brother who studied in Madeenah Uni. When other students were reading over him, he tried to say that the Pope had sent him, and that he has an army who are coming for the student of the Jaami'ah, and that Jewdaism is the true religion, and his rant went on. All lies to try to get us to talk and not recite, to distract the reciter of the Qur'aan. He even made mockery at one of the reciters saying how his recitation was weak and rubbish. But we ignored him, and eventually the truth came out, and what the recitation was doing to him came out. He screamed and shouted, and begged the reciter to stop.

    Like I said before, others may claim to cure possession, but for them it only 'seems' to work in order to further them in their mis-guidance.

  6. #6
    This is interesting however,
    YouTube

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